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1/05/2025 11:58 am  #61


Re: GW BEATS Dayton Game Thread

Good call 509. If you look at the ESPN win probability, the 12:38 mark in the second half is the only time in the last 35 minutes of the game when Dayton’s win probability went over 50%, for a very brief moment.

 

1/05/2025 12:23 pm  #62


Re: GW BEATS Dayton Game Thread

Your right on 509. A scary point of the game. Those turnovers could have been disastrous. Lucky for us UD kept missing easy layups after the turnovers. Great to have a good center. What I also liked about the game is our improvement on rebounding. We made an extra effort on getting the 50/50 balls. 

 

1/05/2025 12:30 pm  #63


Re: GW BEATS Dayton Game Thread

could someone send a link for those who would like to watch the game again?
thanks 

 

1/05/2025 12:31 pm  #64


Re: GW BEATS Dayton Game Thread

Alum '04 wrote:

Wow! I almost forgot how great it can feel to be a GW fan. No one ever wants to not have their best player playing, but after I saw Buchanan in the boot, I hoped that it would force CC to get creative on offense. Seems to have worked.

I also had to rub my eyes because we actually have some depth this year? Seems like we have eight guys who can really play. It's been a few years since we've had more than two.

The best part was how the UD fans got dead silent after the first five minutes in the second half. They were fired up and looking for points and they got loud. But GW shut UD down defensively and kept hitting buckets and the Flyer fans had nothing to cheer for. That was great!

What a way to start the home stretch!

Got the entire spectrum of how much it sucks to be a GW fan to how great it is to be a GW fan in a a 4 day period.

 

1/05/2025 12:55 pm  #65


Re: GW BEATS Dayton Game Thread

On the depth issue, CC’s comment postgame that his biggest challenge this year is finding the best combinations for each game, and situations in each game, is very revealing. A lot of good pieces he has to fit together game-to-game and moment-to-moment. Compared to previous years, kind of a good problem to have.

As I noted earlier, I think one lesson from this game is that we have more lineup flexibility then maybe we thought we had. I love Buchanan but we can compete in certain situations when he is not on the court.

But let’s not get too carried away. Jun is still the best player on the team right now, even though I too would like to see him used differently from time to time. Dayton was clearly unprepared for a lineup without him, which created an advantage for us.

 

1/05/2025 1:17 pm  #66


Re: GW BEATS Dayton Game Thread

Just a couple of irandom thoughs about the Dayton game.

1.    I am proud to say that I accurately predicted we would be 1-1 after 2 games.  (OK...you got me...I thought we would be 0-2).
2.     For the life of me, I don't know what the heck happened on Saturday.  You play against a nationally ranked team without your best player and win by 20?    How was that possible?   It seems we ambushed an over confident  superior opponent with an early gut punch from which they could not recover.   One thing it seems to say is that maybe we have the talent on the team but it should be used differently.
3.    On a few occasions this season, especially when things were going south on the Court, I would comment that we looked almost like a pickup team out there, with a player driving wildly into multiple defenders by the basket while others stood around.   Against Dayton, we just looked better coached.   This has nothing to do with Jun, but it may be an indication that the coaching staff is too reliant on one player when there are players out there who could help if we called their numbers a bit more.  
4.     Wonder if Chrisitan Jones just Wally Pipped Jacoi Hutchinson at the point?    
5.     Nice to have people in the stands.   The game has an entirely different feel.   Would have been nicer if there were fewer red jerseys and more buff and blue.
6.     Wonder what Nessah has to do to stay in the game.  He seems to be playing ok in the limited time he is in.
7.      I was wrong about Drumgoole.   He most certailnly is an A-10 calibre player.   Just had a few growing pains.
8.     Not sure Bevins is ready for prime time yet, as he is still having growing pains.  
9.     Great game Trey Autry.    His making his first shot makes a big difference.   Also nice seeing him do things other than stand in the corner and hope for the ball.   (Again, back to my use of players gripe).
10.    Finally, Richmond and Dayton brings to mind that old sports adage....you are not as bad as you think you are when you lose or as good as you think you are when you win".
 

 

1/05/2025 2:28 pm  #67


Re: GW BEATS Dayton Game Thread

Class 'o 70 wrote:

could someone send a link for those who would like to watch the game again?
thanks 

I had it recorded on my TV but if you get USA Network, I think you can watch the replay here: https://www.usanetwork.com/watch/ncaa/dayton-vs-george-washington/12008191

 

1/05/2025 4:28 pm  #68


Re: GW BEATS Dayton Game Thread

DC Native wrote:

Hugh wrote:

Free Quebec wrote:

As the day has gone on, for whatever reason, our KenPom has climbed to 115.

That’s our highest since a loss to Penn St on November 26, 2016 (we were 110 going into that game).

Richmond beating Umass on the road is probably why

GW’s NET jumped almost 30 spots, from 151 to 123.

That makes us a Quad 2, instead of Quad 3, loss for Dayton.   Dayton and the league really need us to stay in the top 135.  League should let the refs know 😂

 

1/05/2025 5:45 pm  #69


Re: GW BEATS Dayton Game Thread

Just recorded a new episode of GW Basketball Insiders alongside Abe Rothstein. We talked about the big win over Dayton and what the team needs to do to keep the momentum going. Check it out and let us know what you think!

https://www.youtube.com/live/jmUHlyIwMJk?si=VwRfOhuq_rBGAAuh

 

1/05/2025 11:25 pm  #70


Re: GW BEATS Dayton Game Thread

Just wow!!! That's how you respond after how the Richmond game ended. Two straight home games against Dayton under CC where the Flyers haven't led for a single second. It just goes to show how hard it is to win on the road. Mighty impressive, and it was clear the team was ready to go from the start. Easily the best first half of the season. 12 PM tips can be tricky - teams can come out flat with the early start but not GW. I'm surprised I haven't seen some snarky comments about the weak OOC schedule not preparing the team yet after this game.

I have complimented the defense in passing but it needs to be mentioned more after Saturday. The attention to detail was amazing. The Revs really mixed up down low and contested shots well, but most importantly dove for loose balls and really got Dayton out of rhythm with deflections. The former wasn't seen much during OOC - but it was clear this game just meant more. I'm not used to seeing GW turn other teams over on inbounds passes - the Buff and Blue did that twice against Dayton.

Offensively, I loved seeing 16 assists. The ball moved around, and shots were not taken after just a single pass. GW effectively broke Dayton's press and continued to look for buckets on the break. Playing a bit uptempo was key against a Flyer team that prefers to slow it down. The Jun conundrum mentioned by others is an interesting one. While his three point shot not coming along yet is a slight disappointment, the notion that he is overrated is crazy to me. When he gets downhill, he's tough to stop regardless of competition, and despite a couple tough games from the line, 68% isn't terrible.

One of the posters on here astutely pointed out sometime back the difference in shooting between the starters and the bench. For much of the year, the starting unit has been Hutchinson-Moss-Drumgoole-Buchanan-Castro. The only player who can shoot with any consistency from that lineup is Gerald, making it easier for opponents to pack the paint and prevent Jun from getting to the hoop. DBJ needs more shooting around him to open up lanes to actually drive. We all love Jun, but it's okay if he's not bringing the ball up or initiating the offense for every possession that he's in the game. Buff&BlueBandit sums up my thoughts well. Having both CJ and Sean in the game earlier (along with Gerald) may have helped GW get off to a faster start as the spacing was so much better.

Can the team continue to make 15 threes every game moving forward? Of course not. However, unlike the Richmond game GW showed the ability to attack inside, which will come in handy when the team inevitably has an off night from 3.

Player Breakdown:
Rafael - CJ scored the most for the team but I was most impressed with Castro on Saturday. His presence really made the difference on both sides of the ball. Defensively, he can guard pretty much anyone, something that Akingbola was unable to do. While Stretch may have been the better pure shot blocker, when he was caught out of position GW would be in trouble. That's not the case with Rafael. It felt like he was everywhere down low. Also, I had no idea that he led the A10 in offensive rebounding. He had several that were during pivotal moments of the game. Outside of few missed FTs he was fantastic. Glad he was more involved in the offense. We know Sean can pass, but Rafael perhaps doesn't enough credit for being able to do that as well. Early in the game, CC ran the play where Autry cuts off ball for an easy layup. Generally Hansen is the initiator, but this time it was Castro.

Sean - pretty much the same thoughts as Rafael offensively. I like that he took more shots, and hope that doesn't go away when Jun gets back. Adding him as a pick and pop threat really opens up the offense. Defensively, he doesn't get enough credit for being able to anticipate a pass and get in front of his man to intercept the pass.

Trey (Moss) - did a lot of the little things very well. Outside of taking his usual stupid threes (most which felt undershot), I thought he did a lot of things right. Defensively, he dove for loose balls and crashed the glass. Offensively, he was great when he got into the paint. Early on, his penetration led to a kick out to Gerald who found CJ for a 3. More of that would be welcomed. Of course, he had that big and one down the stretch which once again was due to him trying to get to the basket. Good things happen when he does that and doesn't settle for 3.

CJ - after the Richmond game, I was critical of the guards for not getting to the hoop enough. CJ not only made threes, but he proved me wrong just one game later by attacking the hoop, seemingly unafraid of Key standing right in front of the hoop. He lost the ball a couple times during Dayton's run, but his long arms really made things tough on Smith and Bennett which was a big reason why the defense was so effective. It's hard to make the case that he should return to the bench after that performance.

Gerald - his shotmaking has been fantastic lately, but he even more importantly showed the ability to finish inside against Dayton. Also, he really held his ground defensively. There were some questions on that end with him coming into the year but if he can keep that up that will be huge.

Trey (Autry) - great offensive day from him. GW needs him to have fewer games where he goes scoreless on like two missed shots from deep and he doesn't look to attack the hoop at all. His euro-step to put GW up 11 late in the game may have been my favorite play I've seen from him since he arrived. At WRA, he was more than capable of attacking the hoop. He's one of the top shooters on the team - no doubt about that. However, if he becomes strictly a shooter I feel like certain skills are being wasted. I'm surprised that he's never played any PG since coming to GW despite being one in HS. Defensively, Autry tends to have a couple lapses/commits silly fouls but if he can limit those minutes will be there for him. Still like him coming off the bench and providing a lift offensively. Also shoutout to him for calling timeout before falling out of bounds on one play - things a coach's son does. GW is surprisingly ahead of Syracuse on KenPom now.

Jacoi - after all the compliments going towards the other players I don't want to only say negative things about Hutch who is still one of my favorite players. I'll say this - despite the rough stretch he's had offensively, he hasn't let it affect his defense. Additionally, I still like him a lot as a passer, and I think his cool-headedness and ability to calm things down will be beneficial for this team. In the first half, he once again overthrew a lob to Rafael. GW was fortunate not to be called for a travel on that possession. However, in the second half, Jacoi's lob to Castro was better executed. At some point, you have to figure he will have a good shooting day. Boy does he need it for his confidence right now. I still have questions about his drives to the rim. During GW's cold stretch, Hutchinson missed three shots in a row, but the second drive in particular was strange. He didn't angle his drive to the rim, making the level of difficulty on the shot next to impossible. Maybe it's just me, but I just feel like he makes his two point attempts harder than they need to be.

Dayan - thought he looked pretty good in the minutes he played. Defensively, he had a nice stop against a driving Alexander, keeping his arms up without fouling. Really like that he looks to attack the rim offensively. GW needs that balance.

Ty - he makes some freshman mistakes but I've liked what he's provided defensively. During one play, Dayton got out in transition but his quick hands managed to knock the ball out of bounds before a Flyer player was able to go up with it. I like his potential overall.

Next up is another tough one at URI. I wasn't super impressed by Rhody against GMU yesterday, but it will no doubt be a very tough game away from home. Hopefully some lessons were learned with the lineup combinations and the momentum can be carried over to Wednesday.

Gwmayhem wrote:

6) Dayton hating to play at GW is a real thing.  It's crazy since they normally arrive with both more fans and talent.  But just in case you need reminding...

TJ Thompson drove coast to coast to beat them
Wynton Witherspoon got them at the buzzer.
Joe McDonald's putback was a game winner
MoJo beat them
CC is 2-0 at home against them

Both shots came before halftime, but we can add Max and Gerald to the buzzer beaters list as well now!

Some highlights from the game:


 

 

Yesterday 10:13 am  #71


Re: GW BEATS Dayton Game Thread

GWRising, while it's admittedly unfair to refute yours or anyone's points based on the results of one game, I will acknowledge that watching how our guards as a whole performed against Dayton does make it a bit easier to discuss your opinion that our guard play is at a low major level.  Granted that we no longer have an alpha in the backcourt along the lines of a James Bishop.  However, what GW does seem to have is significant depth in the backcourt.  Am not sure how many other A10 teams can rival the backcourt depth of Jacoi-Christian-2 Treys.  Of course, you'd like to see greater consistency but if we're talking about talent, as you were, I'm not sure that a "low major caliber backcourt" could have performed the way GW's backcourt did on Saturday.

What's promising about this group is that everyone brings something to the table.  While Jacoi's shooting woes continued, he is a steady floor general who is also capable of getting points down the stretch of close games.  He does not shy away from big moments the way many players do.  Christian may be a star in the making as was pointed out elsewhere but if you'd like to walk that back a bit, then you can at least say he's a solid shooter, a good distributor, and a hawk at times on defense.  Trey Autry is a streak shooter who is a genuine difference-maker when his shot is on.  I'm not a fan of Trey Moss's outside shot but he gets to the hole with the quickness that we've wanted to see for years, and likely not since Kethan Savage.  Ty Bevins is inexperienced but is gradually gaining some playing time designed to boost his development.  As long as everyone buys into a "team first" concept (no reason to think that's not the case), CC can interchangeably play the combinations who fit a specific game situation or ride the two who are playing better in a given game.  Add all of this up and I'm convinced you have something far greater than a low major caliber backcourt. 

Moving on to Jun, I'm afraid what we're witnessing is a great guy and team leader who was told that he has a chance at the NBA but must improve parts of his game.  This sometimes does work to the detriment of the team even when that's not the intention.    There are two things that come to mind.  One is obviously the three point shooting which Jun has shown an ability to make but not at all with any consistency.  What was confounding against Richmond was that the Spiders threw much taller and slower defenders (primarily Walz) at Jun who was content to take long shots rather than a simple spin move in the lane which almost assuredly would have resulted in layups.  CC recognized early on that Jun is a weapon when starting at or around the top of the key, driving the lane, and then either finishing, getting fouled or dishing to an open shooter.  In these situations, he will typically be guarded by someone who is either too small to contain him or too large to keep up with him.  However, the key here is that defenses must play him as an equal threat to score or pass.   

Maybe Jun is being given this role too frequently (he does appear exhausted at times which is not at all a criticism).  Perhaps sprinkling in more sets where Jun is on the court but does not start with the ball in his hands would keep him fresher.  No matter the case, we are not a better team without Jun and any conversation that even remotely hints at this should be quickly put to rest.  What was encouraging about Saturday was that when the team could not rely on Jun, it showed that it could nevertheless achieve successful results.  Going forward, relying on Jun, but not quite as much as to be overly reliant, might be the answer.

 

Yesterday 10:24 am  #72


Re: GW BEATS Dayton Game Thread

Someone probably already said it already,but this team is better without Buchanan dominating each game in terms of time of possession. This was the best performance of the season. Why? Because all of the players had to share the ball and did exactly that. We need Buchanan's scoring but coach needs to make sure that Buchanan shares the ball. As we all know, basketball is a team game and must be played that way! Lastly, unlike literally all of the prior games, the guys came out fired up and ready to play from the opening tipoff. That was big.

 

Yesterday 10:37 am  #73


Re: GW BEATS Dayton Game Thread

Gwmayhem wrote:

GWRising, while it's admittedly unfair to refute yours or anyone's points based on the results of one game, I will acknowledge that watching how our guards as a whole performed against Dayton does make it a bit easier to discuss your opinion that our guard play is at a low major level. Granted that we no longer have an alpha in the backcourt along the lines of a James Bishop. However, what GW does seem to have is significant depth in the backcourt. Am not sure how many other A10 teams can rival the backcourt depth of Jacoi-Christian-2 Treys. Of course, you'd like to see greater consistency but if we're talking about talent, as you were, I'm not sure that a "low major caliber backcourt" could have performed the way GW's backcourt did on Saturday.

What's promising about this group is that everyone brings something to the table. While Jacoi's shooting woes continued, he is a steady floor general who is also capable of getting points down the stretch of close games. He does not shy away from big moments the way many players do. Christian may be a star in the making as was pointed out elsewhere but if you'd like to walk that back a bit, then you can at least say he's a solid shooter, a good distributor, and a hawk at times on defense. Trey Autry is a streak shooter who is a genuine difference-maker when his shot is on. I'm not a fan of Trey Moss's outside shot but he gets to the hole with the quickness that we've wanted to see for years, and likely not since Kethan Savage. Ty Bevins is inexperienced but is gradually gaining some playing time designed to boost his development. As long as everyone buys into a "team first" concept (no reason to think that's not the case), CC can interchangeably play the combinations who fit a specific game situation or ride the two who are playing better in a given game. Add all of this up and I'm convinced you have something far greater than a low major caliber backcourt.

Moving on to Jun, I'm afraid what we're witnessing is a great guy and team leader who was told that he has a chance at the NBA but must improve parts of his game. This sometimes does work to the detriment of the team even when that's not the intention. There are two things that come to mind. One is obviously the three point shooting which Jun has shown an ability to make but not at all with any consistency. What was confounding against Richmond was that the Spiders threw much taller and slower defenders (primarily Walz) at Jun who was content to take long shots rather than a simple spin move in the lane which almost assuredly would have resulted in layups. CC recognized early on that Jun is a weapon when starting at or around the top of the key, driving the lane, and then either finishing, getting fouled or dishing to an open shooter. In these situations, he will typically be guarded by someone who is either too small to contain him or too large to keep up with him. However, the key here is that defenses must play him as an equal threat to score or pass.

Maybe Jun is being given this role too frequently (he does appear exhausted at times which is not at all a criticism). Perhaps sprinkling in more sets where Jun is on the court but does not start with the ball in his hands would keep him fresher. No matter the case, we are not a better team without Jun and any conversation that even remotely hints at this should be quickly put to rest. What was encouraging about Saturday was that when the team could not rely on Jun, it showed that it could nevertheless achieve successful results. Going forward, relying on Jun, but not quite as much as to be overly reliant, might be the answer.

These were my exact words after the Richmond game ...

"Right now our guard play is probably at a LM level. Somebody needs to step up if we want to not be in the play-in game in the A-10 tournament in March."

"Right now" were the operative words and I was talking about the level of play to that point and not that our guards had a ceiling of Low Major which was made clear by the next statement that we needed more from someone. At least 5 different people agreed with that assessment so I don't think it was that radical of a comment. And I think it was defensible at that point both on the eye test and statistically.

And guess what? CC implicitly agreed (at least as far as subpar guard play) as he benched Jacoi and inserted Christian into the starting lineup. Further, lo and behold, a player did step-up in a big way... Christian Jones. If Christian continues to play at that level and Trey gives you what he did Saturday on a more consistent basis, I will gladly agree that we have more than LM guards. But Saturday surprisingly was one of the few times we were not out played at the guard position all season even against a weak OOC schedule. I hope and pray it continues.

 

Last edited by GWRising (Yesterday 10:38 am)

 

Yesterday 10:46 am  #74


Re: GW BEATS Dayton Game Thread

GWRisng...Actually after the game I thought immediately about your comments which I agreed with. You specifically brought up CJ as a player with the potential to step up. And guess what lol.  Let's hope they can keep it up Wednesday. 

 

Yesterday 10:51 am  #75


Re: GW BEATS Dayton Game Thread

Gwmayhem - Separately, I  want to address your comments regarding Jun. I do think Saturday showed that the offense had more ball movement and more guys moving than before. To what extent that was due to Jun's absence I cannot say with certainty. Some of it may have been the way we were guarded or the points of emphasis by the coaches given Jun's absence. But I do think it is an issue that bears watching as we progress through the season as I do think we get stagnant at times with an over-reliance on Jun. Teams are now adjusting and packing the lane because they are willing to give him threes given his low percentage. Of course, if we can get more movement and other guys become a consistent scoring threat, this will open things up for Jun. So it's a two-part equation: He needs to be better from outside and his teammates need to help him more.

 

Yesterday 10:53 am  #76


Re: GW BEATS Dayton Game Thread

Not sure where the best place to put this was but thought it was interesting to see how everyone is shooting by location this season

Last edited by GW0509 (Yesterday 11:00 am)

 

Yesterday 10:57 am  #77


Re: GW BEATS Dayton Game Thread

Florida Colonial wrote:

GWRisng...Actually after the game I thought immediately about your comments which I agreed with. You specifically brought up CJ as a player with the potential to step up. And guess what lol.  Let's hope they can keep it up Wednesday. 

I think CJ has more wiggle to his game and more size that helps on both ends. He still needs to improve in some areas, namely his ball handling and passing which can be a little loose at time and become a more consistent shooter. To me, he has the highest ceiling of all of guards.

 

Yesterday 1:07 pm  #78


Re: GW BEATS Dayton Game Thread

Rising, kind of a semantics issue as right now could mean:

Right now as in this moment in time

Or it can mean right now as in this is the team we have right now, maybe next year's team will be different.

I interpreted your statement to mean that this team's guard play was (and will be)  low major caliber, which I obviously did not agree with.  Sorry for the confusion.
 

 

Yesterday 2:11 pm  #79


Re: GW BEATS Dayton Game Thread

Here's another interesting chart from the A10Stats account that seems to show why we had success versus Dayton.



Top left are shooters who have a high true shooting percentage but low usage rate in our offense.  For GW, that is Hanson, Jones, Trey Autry, and Castro. 

Bottom right are shooters who have high usage rate in our offense but low true shooting percentage.  For GW, that is Buchanan and Hutchinson.

Top right are shooters who have high usage rate in our offense and higher true shooting percentage.  For GW, that is Drumgoole.

Moss is about where he should be, but maybe can get a little bit more usage in our offense (assuming its driving to the hoop and not corner 3s).

Drumgoole, Autry, and Jones were the three big offensive contributors to our win vs Dayton.  As we've been saying, this doesn't mean that there isn't a place in our offense for Jacoi and Darren, but I think the big takeaway is that the more we can spread the ball around to Jones and Autry (and reduce some of the offensive load of Darren and Jacoi), the more likely it is we can have more days like Saturday.

 

Yesterday 2:36 pm  #80


Re: GW BEATS Dayton Game Thread

1) The difference is possibly we have a team of players with select roles. There really aren't any
Yutas or Yegor or Mike Halls, etc., who are accomplished all around players.
When everyone performs their role and plays together, not always the case say with our passing, shot selection and defense, wins like this can happen even against good teams. At least, it can on Saturday. Jury is out on the rest of the season.
   Most impressive is that it occurred without Jun. Maybe a psychological "Next Man Up," combined with a more open offense and more desire than usual.
2) Jun can do a lot, from surprising ball handling for his size to scoring and rebounding, but 3 point shooting is a challenge, which is fine--as long as he slowly tries to develop the skill during his four years 
at GW. In any case, we are grateful for Jun every day, both as a great player and a fine person.
    We can certainly use him more wisely, than being predictable. But hope he comes back ASAP without
aggravating his injury.
  3) We'll see how we do at RI, as to whether this was a one-off or a harbinger of a better future. The key is consistency, which has been a glaring weakness.
But these past few days have certainly left us quite happy and proud.
So kudos to the players and coaches for Saturday's big win.
     

 

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